A 15 year old gay boy shot to dead

[cool]

About a week ago, a 15 year old school boy who was openly gay was shot to death for being who he was born to be, gay!

Found this on yahoo!

Should the MURDER of a 15yr old GAY school boy be acceptable to homophobic American Christian Churches?
A 15 yr old boy shot in the head by a fellow pupil at school on Tuesday (this week) because the victim was gay!

Lawrence King, who was reportedly openly gay, was shot twice while in class at a junior high school in Oxnard, California. USA.

A fourteen-year-old boy, has been arrested and charged with the homophobically motivated murder.

Ventura County prosecutors said the killing was a premeditated hate crime and the killer would be charged as an adult.

The Los Angeles Times reports:

"Several students said King and a group of boys, including the defendant, had a verbal confrontation concerning King's sexual orientation a day before the killing."

Adults knew of the homophobic bullying, but did nothing to prevent or curb it.

Children should be safe in schools:-

Homophobia in education establishments must be zero tolerrated.

More on Yahoo

This is yet another problem with Religion and Christianity. So much hatred is taught to children.... This is bad, that is bad,... let's kill people who don't believe the same way we do...

For people who thinks 'faith' is harmless, I say think again.

Here's what the bible says:

Leviticus 20:13: "If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads"

That's as clear as it can get.

[Zibeoh]

What the hell ever happened to "Thou shalt not kill" ????

[cool]

Originally Posted by Zibeoh

What the hell ever happened to "Thou shalt not kill" ????

The bible is just a bunch of stories... wonderful stories that is, so long as we don't take it seriously. Unfortunately people thinks it's the 'word' of god and therefore cherry pick phrases here and there.

If you read the bible carefully, you'll find more 'thou shalt kill, maim, torture, stone to death, rot in hell', then the one 'thou shalt not kill'.

[Jequila]

Wow now, don't go bashing Christians just because some of them are stupid and don't follow all the teachings. People like that aren't even real Christians, just people looking for excuses. I'm a strong Christian, and I have a gay friend. I wish that they weren't that way, because I believe that they will not have a pleasant life after death, but I would never do anything like that.

...Please don't call the teachings that I live my life by 'a bunch of stories' D:

[.em.]

^I'm feeling about the same way as Jequila on this one....(even though I'm not religious...)

I've actually heard that rules such as that (the killing, etc), weren't effective anymore after the time of Jesus. I'm not into religion anymore though, so I may be wrong.
And I'm sure some Christians are just about as upset at this as non-Chrsitians are (as it gives them a bad name). Also, it says nowhere in the article that the murder was a direct influence of his religion, nor does it state his religion (Christianity is not the only religion that believes that homosexuality is wrong).

Anyway, its really horrible that people would kill like that. >__<

[CandyTsuki]

@Jequila

I mean no disrespect, but how can you even say that?

What happens after death can't be determined a book, by you, or me, or priests, or judges, politicians, or any human, for that matter.

[cool]

Originally Posted by Jequila

Wow now, don't go bashing Christians just because some of them are stupid and don't follow all the teachings. People like that aren't even real Christians, just people looking for excuses. I'm a strong Christian, and I have a gay friend. I wish that they weren't that way, because I believe that they will not have a pleasant life after death, but I would never do anything like that.

...Please don't call the teachings that I live my life by 'a bunch of stories' D:

Jequila,

I stand by my right to say what's right... which is that religion is bad... Christianity included and in this case it proves it... When our entire teachings or morality is based on a bunch of stories over a thousand years old, that says a lot.

On the one hand I applaud you for 'not folloing the teachings of your own religion' by being kind to a gay fellow, but then on the other, you believe that it's right your friend shall rot in hell for eternity... doesn't this make you think? just for a sec?

Anyways, I didn't make it up...

here's a direct quote from the bible again:

Leviticus 20:13: "If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads"

So, which part of that is un-christian? IT's IN the bible... or, are you saying that the bible is a bunch of stories after all and not to be believed?

Now, I would say that a lot of Christians today have taken some moral lessons from atheists by adopting them such as 'love gay people as well as thy christian neighbors'.... a hundred years ago, and gay people would not be as tolerated as much as they are today.

But don't confuse 'truth from fiction'... Christians do not accept gay people... period. Maybe one day they would more and more, but it'll not be a christian moral, it'll be an atheist moral.... which is more and more adopted by religious people because they understand how bad their own morals may be in today's enlightened days.

[xsakurahanax]

@cool

I suppose it's true. My friend who is a serious christian takes the bible seriously, at one point she had told me that she thought JK Rowling was a real witch, and that she's evil. However, I suppose it is true that one day, the face of christianity would change. Much like early catholic and christian values. But aren't some gay people christians too?

[.em.]

Originally Posted by cool

Now, I would say that a lot of Christians today have taken some moral lessons from atheists by adopting them such as 'love gay people as well as thy christian neighbors'....

Or how about a moral lesson from Jesus? Anyone recall "Love thy neighbor?"
geez, don't rip it apart. Even if you disagree. Show some respect. And make sure you know both sides before you try to disprove/discredit something, and that you can correctly back them up. Otherwise, your claims are baseless.

[Jequila]

I do follow the teachings :/ They don't need to be killed anymore, because they can be forgiven. Jesus has payed in blood for their sins already.

I don't remember the exact verse, but it also says in the bible to basically be kind to everyone no matter if they're rich/poor Christian/non-Christian.

And that's not what's 'right', it's you're opinion. Each to our own, but you shouldn't criticize another's.

[.em.]

^Right. I remember that verse too from when I used to read the Bible.

[katzluva]

I've read the first 1/4 of the bible, and it has sooooo many contradictions it makes my head spin! What was it...wasnt there this one part where they say incest (having sexual intercourse with family) is a sin, but then later you see that God cleansed the earth leaving all but one family left...then they miraculously had children whose children had children. O__o

And well, quite frankly, people shoot each other all the time, for a variety of reasons...Christianity is just one of it. Personally I wouldn't point so much fingers and emphasis on it alone. People can be evil, with and without religion yup.

Get rid of the right to bear arms, I say. Give em' knives instead...having to stab someone's flesh makes it so much more difficult, personal, and revolting ~ people are far less likely to kill that way.

[creativityisbliss33]

I've actually sat down and made an effort to understand God and Christianity and I have to agree with Katzluva.However, it's not just the bible that'd full of hypocrisy. I believe it is the majority of Christians in general. Yes, you may not shoot someone, but how many of your have had prejudiced thoughts against another or have cheated on a test, or have passed in the lunch line. Simple things like that show a person's character, yet aren't all those simple things wrong. I believe that Christianity is just an excuse to mess up and say "Oh, well I repented so that makes it okay..."

Yet people can be evil without religion.
Heck, I've seen it.
However, to me religion is just another excuse.

I've tried to find a religion that suits me. I've turned to some of the oddest things, but they are all full of contradictions. It's unbelievable...

[cool]

Originally Posted by .em.

Or how about a moral lesson from Jesus? Anyone recall "Love thy neighbor?"
geez, don't rip it apart. Even if you disagree. Show some respect. And make sure you know both sides before you try to disprove/discredit something, and that you can correctly back them up. Otherwise, your claims are baseless.

First: I do understand christianity. I am born into a christian family, raised as such, even baptised, went to sunday school every sunday and was extremely religious until the age of 12.. then slowly i see the truth...

Second: Why respect something that is responsible for so much horror? And none of my claims are baseless... The pope once said that Black people are not real people. They are animals and that their belongings can be taken freely and they can be made slaves. Baseless? Check the Papal Bulls (laws laid down by the popes...)

The reason I speak out againts religion is because I see it as an evil that in today's enlightened society, we no longer need. It is responsible for much hatred... perhaps some would say the root of MOST evil...

When you're brought up to believe in non-facts and are taught that knowledge is evil, that in itself is the main cause of so much hatred today... because we don't understand things... even when the knowledge is out there...

Originally Posted by Jequila

I do follow the teachings :/ They don't need to be killed anymore, because they can be forgiven. Jesus has payed in blood for their sins already.

So, you're saying that no matter how evil someone is, they will automatically be forgiven? So why so much hatred towards gay people? Why the prejudice.. Jequila, would you support gay marriage?

And if Jesus forgave gay people, why then you believe your friend the gay will be punished in hell?

And if everyone is 'saved', why bother be a Christian?

Don't get me wrong... you are picking and choosing what to believe in the Bible, and interprets it however you wish... therein lies the problem.. I rather believe in universal moral values.. that can easily be derived from logic and scientific knowledge.

I don't remember the exact verse, but it also says in the bible to basically be kind to everyone no matter if they're rich/poor Christian/non-Christian.

I would like to hear such a quote that says be nice to gay people.

And that's not what's 'right', it's you're opinion. Each to our own, but you shouldn't criticize another's.

Why not? I am not angry, but like to make my points made. Why is religion off limits? Why is it that you can critisize gay people and I can't defend them? Why is 'faith' automatically 'angry' from any critism? Why is religion above the law and freedom of speech?

If it's wrong, I'll critisize it.. You have heard me write about Bush and the war in Iraq when the 200,000 civilian muslims lost their lives.. you'll hear me defend christians when the taliban kills them, you'll hear me defend the defenseless... it doesn't matter who they are.. if they are gay, persecuted, i'll defend them...

Originally Posted by katzluva

I've read the first 1/4 of the bible, and it has sooooo many contradictions it makes my head spin!

Katz, you have just pointed out why Religions is bad.... People can justify anything from the bible... they can quote anything, interpret it anyway they wish and when society deems something they do as wrong, they'll eventually quote other passages and justify it by saying 'well, not all christians do that.. '. The main fact is that when we rely our moral judgement on pieces of stories that are way outdated and cling on to it, that's when all hell breaks lose...

And well, quite frankly, people shoot each other all the time, for a variety of reasons...Christianity is just one of it. Personally I wouldn't point so much fingers and emphasis on it alone. People can be evil, with and without religion yup.

True... people do evil things for all kinds of reasons.. one of the biggest is probably for power and therein you'll find dictators.. But we should speak out against ALL of them. In this case, it's the Christians.. who are constantly gay-bashing.. therefore, we should speak out againts them. Katz, you see that I do not only bash the Christians, but all Religions... when it's not base on facts, it's bad... period.. and people justify using it for all kinds of evil things.

But not speaking out againts evil when we encounter them, we actually allow them to flourish...

Get rid of the right to bear arms, I say. Give em' knives instead...having to stab someone's flesh makes it so much more difficult, personal, and revolting ~ people are far less likely to kill that way.

This is another truth that we talked about... making guns illegal would make it harder for people to kill each other... but then should I stop critisizing people who believe in their absolute rights to bear arms? No, I won't stop... until we have no rights to kill each other...

... ciao!

[Darien]

I can't believe that someone would kill someone just for being gay. I actually lived through the fact one of my friends were shot. But it wasn't for being gay, it was just because of something incredibly stupid such as the color of his jacket. What happened with the senseless killing of this King kid for being gay is a fine example of why they should update the bible and end this hatred of gays and lesibans. I guess this is why religion should be banned because if it inspired this hate crime, then I don't even want to imagine more of this stuff happening.

[cool]

Originally Posted by Darien

I guess this is why religion should be banned because if it inspired this hate crime, then I don't even want to imagine more of this stuff happening.

Actually we ban a lot of religions today. They are called cults. Their leaders are sometimes arrested. But the biggest, oldest, surviving religions are so influencial today that it's impossible to ban them. Imagine banning Christianity or Islam or Hindu, etc... You will have a nightmare enforcing it since most of the police would be angry at you.

It'll take time for religion to slowly disappear as every new generation learns more and more logic...... You see how 'angry' people get when they perceive that their 'god' or 'religion' is under attack. The cartoonists who drew the image of Muhammad are now on the run from jihadists... Talking about religion can really be a dangerous thing, even today.

Religion = Big Cults.

[katzluva]

Just to point out, religion has done a lot of good deeds too! Okay, so billions have been slaughtered for God's sake, but countless number of people found real/artificial meaning in their lives, gotten out of depression, and became a better person from their new beliefs. It's difficult to get a real estimate of this, which is why it's so much easier to note the bad cause the killing number is there. It's also soooo typical of human nature to overlook something when it's done good, hmm?

Aside from that, I'm all for the scientific political leader.

[xivorymoonx]

I was raised as a Catholic...and I've never read the bible. I've been to church every sunday, and Sunday school every sunday for nine years of my childhood. Never once have I been taught that gay people should be killed. Times have changed since the bible was written, and that's why in most Sunday schools they don't even show the bible to children. I know that most things in there are unjust, but I also know what I've been taught by modern teachers of Christianity, and they are very righteous and kind.
But, like you, as I've grown I've realized that the stories are just stories. I don't really believe that all of them happened, but I believe there's inspiration in there. THere's faith. But some of the laws are still valuble. Now, I said some, ok? Some. So don't get off on me for that one.

I think gay people and black people are the same as straight and white people. There is no reason that a gay person should be killed. There is no reason for a black person to be seen as an animal. It's pretty much just a matter of being outnumbered and unpowerful. Because if there were more black people, or more gay people, things might be turned around.

There are people in this world who want things to be routine and traditional. And tradionally, Christians didn't like gay people. But they are changing. Gradually.

Religion though, should absolutly not be banned. People need to live off a motivation. Like Christians, they want to live peacefully in their afterlives. So they try their hardest not to sin, always ask for forgiveness, and be generous. Do they really go to heaven? Perhaps not, but they lived off great morals and became great people because they believed in something.

YOu're saying that religious people can be evil...but anyone can be evil. And what about mother teresa? SHe's helped many people and it was all for her love of God's creations. And at my church, twice a year we all have what we call rice bowls that we fill up with spare change, and then give them to the church and it's given to poor families in South America. There's also missionaries that my uncle went on to Hondorus to help build homes that many Catholics go on, simply by volunteering. Many Christians are moral, believe it or not.

Religion will never disapear. No matter how much we discover, there will always be people who believe in some entity that looms over them. And just as much as people will do evil, people will also do good.

And though there are Christians out there who read this murder and are happy this kid died, there are many more that are very disapointted and embarressed by the people in our faith who act this way. I know I am.

[Tsuyako]

I'm not religious myself, but I have read the Bible.
People are entitled to their own beliefs but I think it's too extreme when events like this occur.
People, no matter what they're like or who they are, are entitled to live a free life without having to worry about things like this.
I hope he rests in peace =[

[.em.]

Originally Posted by xivorymoonx

I was raised as a Catholic...and I've never read the bible. I've been to church every sunday, and Sunday school every sunday for nine years of my childhood. Never once have I been taught that gay people should be killed. Times have changed since the bible was written, and that's why in most Sunday schools they don't even show the bible to children. I know that most things in there are unjust, but I also know what I've been taught by modern teachers of Christianity, and they are very righteous and kind.
But, like you, as I've grown I've realized that the stories are just stories. I don't really believe that all of them happened, but I believe there's inspiration in there. THere's faith. But some of the laws are still valuble. Now, I said some, ok? Some. So don't get off on me for that one.

I think gay people and black people are the same as straight and white people. There is no reason that a gay person should be killed. There is no reason for a black person to be seen as an animal. It's pretty much just a matter of being outnumbered and unpowerful. Because if there were more black people, or more gay people, things might be turned around.

There are people in this world who want things to be routine and traditional. And tradionally, Christians didn't like gay people. But they are changing. Gradually.

Religion though, should absolutly not be banned. People need to live off a motivation. Like Christians, they want to live peacefully in their afterlives. So they try their hardest not to sin, always ask for forgiveness, and be generous. Do they really go to heaven? Perhaps not, but they lived off great morals and became great people because they believed in something.

YOu're saying that religious people can be evil...but anyone can be evil. And what about mother teresa? SHe's helped many people and it was all for her love of God's creations. And at my church, twice a year we all have what we call rice bowls that we fill up with spare change, and then give them to the church and it's given to poor families in South America. There's also missionaries that my uncle went on to Hondorus to help build homes that many Catholics go on, simply by volunteering. Many Christians are moral, believe it or not.

Religion will never disapear. No matter how much we discover, there will always be people who believe in some entity that looms over them. And just as much as people will do evil, people will also do good.

And though there are Christians out there who read this murder and are happy this kid died, there are many more that are very disapointted and embarressed by the people in our faith who act this way. I know I am.

I think I agree with you on pretty much every point. I think you said a lot that I was thinking/feeling that I didn't get to say, or could not have expressed as clearly.

Thank you for your post, it was very nice, and very much needed (IMO).